Military Tests the SCAR

[Dredly]

btw - here is ANOTHER one

http://www.robarm.com/

There are a pretty substantial number of these... for a reason. the US Military put out a contest for SCAR rifles (SOF Combat Assault Rifle) and the requirements are changeable caliber and barrel system I believe... the FN SCAR (SCAR-L, Mk 16 Mod 0) and Heavy (SCAR-H, Mk 17 Mod 0) were renamed once they won the contract.

for the civ market:

I believe the http://www.robarm.com/ XCR one can be had for around 1500.00+... (cheapest on the SCAR style rifles I believe), These are already available for purchase as I believe this rifle got knocked out of the competition a LONG time ago... it operates on a kalashnikov (sp?) style blow back like an AK47 which stands no chance of winning a contract in the US, no matter how good it is. changes for different cals or barrels are around 550.00 each I think.

The bushmaster ACR (Magpul Masada) is supposed to be avail for LEO and Civ next year (Based on this: http://www.bushmaster.com/press_release_013108.asp) however no word on price AFAIK. I doubt it will sell overly well as a LEO weapon as it s going to be much more expensive then a standard AR and 99.99999999% of cops won't need to ever switch calibers or barrel lengths (the 2 benefits to this weapon). I would anticipate a much better response from the civ market where we will buy anything that looks military

I think the FN Scar is not going to be made avail for the public, just like most of FN's weapons designed for the military. I think when they won the SCAR comp there was some sort of agreement that its NATO only without US expressed permission or something similar

the HK416's are 6K - 7k+ if you can find them, no clue on the HK417s

the XM8's are not going to be produced in the US as far as I know and I'm pretty sure our gov't isn't going allow them to be imported as H&K basically took the US Gov't's 40,000,000+ and wasted it on a firearm that lost the competition we were paying for it to be built to win. Talk about the favorite losing out.

[arrrrgh15]

Right.

Its a nice weapon, some SF guys seem to like it and so does that bald guy from that TV show, and you can switch from a long barrel version to a short barrel pretty easy, so long as you maintain the same caliber. If I want multi caliber I've gotta pack extra mags, ammo, lower, upper, etc.

They'll be able to ditch the M4, Mk18, M16, Mk12, and DMR and replace it with the SCAR-L.

They'll be able to ditch the M14, SR-25, and XM-110 and replace it with the SCAR-H, AND get to add a short barrel version to the equation.

The function and maintenance of both will be almost identical. Same muscle memory for each. And repair parts for the most part would be interchangable.

Still, I can take my M4 and pop two pins and throw the SPR upper on it.

I still haven't found any accuracy claims for the long barreled 7.62 version. And I don't believe FN is toting it as a "sniper rifle".

ETA: The XM8s were an abortion. I hope HK threw some awesome company picnics with that $40,000,000!!! I'm sure somebody in the pentagon thought it was "cool looking" though.

[RONNIE77]

Originally Posted by Dredly

the HK416's are 6K - 7k+ if you can find them

The HK416 is amazing. I saw some video testing on it (future weapons) and youtube. My buddy has a 10" 416 upper that he bought about a year ago, he paid $3,400.00 for it. He has put close to 3000 rounds through already, and has yet to clean it. "0" fails....so far.

He also has some friends that work for FN, who informed him that the SCAR-L is supposed to be available to the civilian market around Nov. or Dec. of this year.
Only the SCAR-L (5.56 NATO) version in three barrel lengths, however the SCAR-H (7.62 NATO) version will not be available. But who knows if it will even make it. Things change everyday.

[chauncey]

Originally Posted by Dredly

you'd rather use a pistol to clear rooms full of guys with fully auto AK47's then a short barreled, accurate, very powerful assault rifle with 30 round mags full of death compared to 15 rounds of piss a guy off?

yes. remember, there is one DMR rifle per squad, so I'd have 3 or 4 carbine-equipped soldiers, behind me.

an accurate, hard hitting high-capacity pistol plays an important role in MOUT/MOBU missions, because thereis an advantage to having at least one of the entry personnel able to operate a weapon with one hand.

remember, it's a group activity.

[NineseveN]

Originally Posted by chauncey

yes. remember, there is one DMR rifle per squad, so I'd have 3 or 4 carbine-equipped soldiers, behind me.

an accurate, hard hitting high-capacity pistol plays an important role in MOUT/MOBU missions, because thereis an advantage to having at least one of the entry personnel able to operate a weapon with one hand.

remember, it's a group activity.

I seem to recall something about chains and their weakest links...

[headcase]

Originally Posted by chauncey

yes. remember, there is one DMR rifle per squad, so I'd have 3 or 4 carbine-equipped soldiers, behind me.

an accurate, hard hitting high-capacity pistol plays an important role in MOUT/MOBU missions, because thereis an advantage to having at least one of the entry personnel able to operate a weapon with one hand.

remember, it's a group activity.

Silly rabbit, if you are going in to clear a dwelling, even as a DMR, and not using your M-4 or equivalent, you are not going in with anyone behind you. If you do, you are very likely to wind up with boot marks up and down your back, from being knocked down and stepped on. Your sidearm is your SHTF weapon, and your long gun is for when you have reached your mission AO, between those two situations, you are humping a M-4 as well. Just sayin'...

[chauncey]

Originally Posted by headcase

Silly rabbit, if you are going in to clear a dwelling, even as a DMR, and not using your M-4 or equivalent, you are not going in with anyone behind you. If you do, you are very likely to wind up with boot marks up and down your back, from being knocked down and stepped on. Your sidearm is your SHTF weapon, and your long gun is for when you have reached your mission AO, between those two situations, you are humping a M-4 as well. Just sayin'...

oh, sorry, "Army of One" I thought MOUT and room-to-room was a group activity. I guess I'll go back and tell my MOUT instructors that they were wrong, I was supposed to step on the back of my pistol-armed squad leader when entering a room.

thanks for reminding me why I don't bother posting much on these forums, what with all of the armchair experts ready to ambush me the minute I let the cool-aid run dry in my mouth.

you win. pistols have no role in room clearing.

go grab your 4 scar barrels, and clear some rooms, solo.

[headcase]

Originally Posted by chauncey

oh, sorry, "Army of One" I thought MOUT and room-to-room was a group activity. I guess I'll go back and tell my MOUT instructors that they were wrong, I was supposed to step on the back of my pistol-armed squad leader when entering a room.

thanks for reminding me why I don't bother posting much on these forums, what with all of the armchair experts ready to ambush me the minute I let the cool-aid run dry in my mouth.

you win. pistols have no role in room clearing.

go grab your 4 scar barrels, and clear some rooms, solo.

No problemo, just here to help

BTW...Could you maybe quote where I said it was a one man job? You keep mentioning it when you get corrected, but I maybe missed anyone but you bringing it up?

BTW(PART II)... If your primary weapon jams, or you are out of ammo, of course your next step is employ the pistol. If all your team has are pistols, then I guess you are clearing with pistols. But if everyone has M-4s available, how is it you are going in first or second with a pistol out? Maybe as a rear security you can resort to it, but seriously, I ain't assuming your room is full of non threats after you cleared it with a pop gun because wounded guys still shoot back. Or are you talking about a residential criminal warrant breech? I'm assuming well armed hostiles, not pot smoking stoners....