semi-auto accuracy

[Rosko Packer]

Just fishing for some opinions about semi-a pistol accuracy. What do you think it should be? I have always shot my SAs at 25yds to find the best ammo and get an idea of accuracy. I only use an old pillow for a rest (like to have one of those mechanical holders, but...someday). I have read gun tests of 1911s that talk about 3inch groups at 25 being very good. I have also read tests that are done at 20 feet. Accuracy is what I love in a firearm (long or short). I'm wondering if I'm asking or expecting 2 much from things as to what their true capabilities are. I just want my firearms to be able to outshoot me. I have over a dozen semi's of various calibers. Some have surprized and impressed me, some have been a bit disapointing. Please give me your opinions about this and maybe some examples of your own semi's abilities.

[hzox221]

Accuracy generally improves the with the more $$$ you spend on a gun.

Some 1911 are advertised as 1" MOA at 50 yards.

[Shawn.L]

my Wilson Combat is guaranteed to shoot 1.25 at 25 yards

I know that they guarantee the supergrade Wilsons at 1 inch at 25 yards

The other day I hit a 10 inch gong at 100 yards with my Wilson resting my arms on a bench shooting Remmington UMC.

It was so fricken sweet. First shot hit it, and I just burned the rest of the mag into the berm cause I didnt want to ruin it.

[625]

I agree with a poster on another forum I used to spend time at. He said that he doesn't know why so many people consider "combat accuracy" as being adequate. I agree. When did we lower our standards as a whole? Why are 3-5 inch groups at 25 yards adequate? Gun makers can certainly do better and not spend a ton of money. My 625 is a good example. It can hang with guns that are 2-4 times as expensive all day long. Sure, it's not a semi-auto, but it's also not super expensive, so it can be done. I just don't understand why no manufacturer has been able to find a way to make a center-fire semi-auto shoot 1 inch groups for less than $1,000. Maybe I'm just naive. Maybe the average shooter is not as demanding as they should be.

I think another reason why semi-auto's don't seem as accurate as they should be is the fact that most people don't reload and/or take the time to find a load that shoots well in their gun. Expensive ammo does not mean accuracy.

[synergy]

Originally Posted by 625

I just don't understand why no manufacturer has been able to find a way to make a center-fire semi-auto shoot 1 inch groups for less than $1,000. Maybe I'm just naive. Maybe the average shooter is not as demanding as they should be.

Most shooters can't shoot 1 hole groups at 7 yards....why should they spend the money on something that they can't take advantage of?

There's a trade-off to make when it comes to accuracy and reliability...considering the mission of most handguns, reliability is paramount.

If you want both, be prepared to spend some loot.

[Rosko Packer]

I have a Steyr 40cal M that I can shoot into less than 2 inches at 25 yds, I also have an EAA Witness 10mm that will do the same. I think that with a mechanical rest it could well B scary with either gun. I also have a Ruger SR9 9mm that I have given up even trying to adjust the sights on. One shot will B 4in high and 4in right, the next 4in low and 4in left! I think the Steyr triangle sights help a lot (I'm one of those "weirdos" that happens to love them). The EAA has the more standard handgun 3dots,so it's not just a sight picture thing. I do use factory ammo, but I try as many different examples as I can find. Question: Would ammo of a particular type (weight,brand,handload recipe,whatever) that worked well in one gun and model, say for example a Taurus PT1911, be likely to work well in another PT1911? Or can it be that one gun of the same make and model might shoot 230gr Rem. (just throwing an example) like a dream and fling 180gr whatever all over the place, where the identical PT shoots the 180 great and flings the 230? I hope this isn't a stupid question, but if makes and models have at least a GENERAL preference for a certain ammo, it would be helpful to have sort of a starting point.

[CommonHighrise]

On "combat accuracy"; This is not a term intended for use as a description of a firearms overall accuracy, but for the accuracy of the shooter firing at a combat pace. It has much more to do with the shooter than the gun itself. For instance, I can use my GP100 for 3" groups with carry ammo at 25yrds using slow, single action shots. That number grows to around 12" at the same distance and ammo when shooting rapid (sub-second) double action shots.

Most experts seem to settle on the 12"/25yrd mark for being combat accurate with a firearm. Couldnt tell you where these numbers originated, Id wager some old military qualification standard.

Also, to make a correction, 1"@50yrds isnt one MOA, its around two. MOA is a unit of measurment used to quantify and compare accuracy at different ranges easily. It comes from each degree in a 360 degree circle having 60 minutes within it. Simply, a minute of angle is 1/60th of 1 degree. Lots of math involved, but an easy way to remember is one inch at 100 yards is about 1 MOA.

[625]

Most shooters can't shoot 1 hole groups at 7 yards....why should they spend the money on something that they can't take advantage of?

The point is, they do. Lots of wealthy people own guns that have far more accuracy than they can "get" out of them. Just because you can afford a $3000 custom 1911, or a Sig P210, doesn't mean you can shoot well. My point was, it obviously helps even lousy shooters to shoot better groups when they have an accurate gun to begin with. My point is, why do the accurate semi-auto's cost so much? That's somewhat of a rhetorical question, since I do know that most of the really nice ones are hand fitted, use higher quality barrels, and so on. I'm just wondering why in the era of CNC equipment, some company has not been able to produce an affordable tack driver.

On "combat accuracy"; This is not a term intended for use as a description of a firearms overall accuracy, but for the accuracy of the shooter firing at a combat pace.

Agreed, this is similar to clip and magazine. Once it becomes a commonly misused term, it takes on a different meaning. I am now pistol-whipping my nutsack to punish myself for taking part in this process.

[knight0334]

Unless you're shooting competition - expecting that kind of accuracy is really asinine.

Dinner plate sized groups out to 25yrd is all that is really necessary. Anything more than that is just for bragging rights.

[Rosko Packer]

Are you talking dinner plate groups with a rest, or free hand shooting? It seems that a rested gun that can only be counted on to put a shot SOMEWHERE in a 10in circle might be a little wearing on confidence free hand.