A sign causes lawsuit

[Kumarian]

The thing that I find most interesting is that in both the Philly and the PGH examples here is that it is an immigrant who is posting the signs.

These people have seen what this country can do for them if they work hard and become a part of its society. These are the people who I would like to emulate .. hard working providers .. as opposed to many of the "Americans" who are on welfare because the country "owes" them something.

[soberbyker]

Originally Posted by Kumarian

The thing that I find most interesting is that in both the Philly and the PGH examples here is that it is an immigrant who is posting the signs.

These people have seen what this country can do for them if they work hard and become a part of its society. These are the people who I would like to emulate .. hard working providers .. as opposed to many of the "Americans" who are on welfare because the country "owes" them something.

here here .... +1 from me

[SGTUSArmy]

Let's talk assimilation....

My great grandmother was 100% Cherokee Indian. My Great Great Grandfather claimed 50% Cherokee so that he could work (his journals actual tells when he did this.) He later helped organize the land run, and provided for the reservations and land grants for the Cherokee, Choctaw, and Creek Nations in Oklahoma.

I can go off on a tirade. I will not out of fairness and the how it would start the whole racism debate, and I would have to pull out the trump card. Let me just pose this one question....when you think of America, what language do you see people speaking?

I am an American Indian. I do not speak Cherokee because it would not be "benefitial" to me. I do not speak spanish because I speak English. I spent three years in Okinawa. I learned some Japanese, because it was easier than trying to find someone who spoke English, even though they were abundant. I learned to read the signs so that I knew if it was a Men's or Women's restroom. I was there for 3 years, and did that. Why can't it be expected that someone who has been here for 10 do the same?

As for the National Language.....what language is the Constitution and Declaration of Independence written in? Are going to have to go back in time and the get the founding fathers to write one in Spanish, French, Chinese, Viet Namese, Mandarin, Japanese, Portugese, Italian, Latin, Farsi, Persian Farsi, Arabic, Russian, German and Dutch?

As for the illegal immigration....let's follow the Japanese lead on this one. Those that are found illegally residing in Japan have two options....deportation or they can stay in Japan.....If they stay they are doing hard labor in prison for a minimum of 3 years. In Japanese prison there is no cable tv, no internet, no college classes, no steak and lobster nights. They work all day, and then get rice and fish head soup.

[TravisBickle]

Here's my take -

If the people of PA want to have public accomodations laws forcing restaruants to serve black people/speak Spanish/ban smoking/whatever else, then the people of PA will elect lawmakers who will pass such laws.

If the people of NJ don't want the same public accomodations laws as PA, then the people of NJ will elect lawmakers who will reflect this attitude in their laws.

My main problem is that some of these laws were passed at the Federal level where they don't belong. I personally side with freedom of association.

[budney]

If the people of PA want to have public accomodations laws forcing restaruants to serve black people/speak Spanish/ban smoking/whatever else, then the people of PA will elect lawmakers who will pass such laws.

Is it just for a majority to vote your private property rights away? What if most of the people in PA want to seize the property of all PA blacks? Or Jews? Or Catholics? Would that be justified because "the people have spoken"?

--Len.

[SGTUSArmy]

Originally Posted by budney

Is it just for a majority to vote your private property rights away? What if most of the people in PA want to seize the property of all PA blacks? Or Jews? Or Catholics? Would that be justified because "the people have spoken"?

--Len.

It's called emminent domain. Supreme Court already said that it is legal. Happened in Baltimore. Low income, black neighborhood, worth LOTS OF MONEY, and the city of Baltimore seized it and gave it to developers. Now it's called the Inner Harbor.

[TravisBickle]

Originally Posted by budney

Is it just for a majority to vote your private property rights away? What if most of the people in PA want to seize the property of all PA blacks? Or Jews? Or Catholics? Would that be justified because "the people have spoken"?

--Len.

Your comparison doesn't hold water. There's a difference between regulating business conduct and outright property confiscation.

I oppose regulations just as much as you, but if we must have them, I'd rather have these laws at the State level than the Federal level. At least that way I can leave and go to another State if I want to smoke in a bar that badly. Oh and by the way - it's the way our founders intended it to be.

[budney]

Originally Posted by MorganB

Your comparison doesn't hold water. There's a difference between regulating business conduct and outright property confiscation.

Both are violations of rights. You appear to be saying that a majority is allowed to violate another's property rights. What gives them that right?

It's called emminent domain.

Eminent domain is legal, but immoral (and unnecessary). Eminent domain means that you don't own your property at all: the government owns it. You're allowed to act as if you own it, but only until the government says otherwise.

--Len.

[TotalNewbie]

Originally Posted by ChamberedRound

This one really aggravates me. Last time I checked, a business owner was allowed to refuse service to anyone for any reason, as the business is private property.

Yes and no. Depending on the jurisdiction, you are able to discriminate on the basis of some characteristic, but not on another. For example, it would be tough for a court to say that it is OK to discriminate on the basis of race, religion. The rules for discrimination of the basis of national origin, or sex are not as iron-clad, and there are exceptions.

And even though a restaurant may be a private property, responsibilities and rules about the owner’s behavior towards the customers are quite different then those of home-owners.

[TotalNewbie]

Originally Posted by Kumarian

The thing that I find most interesting is that in both the Philly and the PGH examples here is that it is an immigrant who is posting the signs.

This is nothing new. The earlier immigrants are more demanding and more critical of of newer immigrants than are native people.