had to shoot a cat

[ungawa]

Originally Posted by Jackal

I'd rather not get into some details, but I had to shoot a cat the other day...

My question is, how could such a powerful round not instantly kill the cat...

... Any insight?

More research and testing is needed. Until they start shitting squirrels and moles instead of coughing up bird bones and spraying my door.

[Tomcat088]

Originally Posted by XD40coyote

I personally necropsied a selection of raccoons and found that some seemed to have a devasted entire lower rear brain= as in exiting at the foramen magnum. I can do more of these this season and really check it out. I have never once had a raccoon NOT jump around from a head shot. Maybe they are like chickens.

I just wanted to mention something XD40, and I know you have dissected many specimens. Throughout my college career and in the field as a hunter I've done quite my fair share as well. Although they are sometimes devastated through the foramen magnum, this does not necessarily mean that the medulla and cerebellum parts of of the brain have been damaged. As far as I know, the only way to get a "zero reflex" kill when damaging the spinal column (in a way the area of the foreman magnum) is to completely sever it. Even when the spine is damages, if it is not completed severed, then you will sometimes see reflexes, twitching, etc. Even with spinal column shots (even at the base of the head), I've usually seen some reflex movements like tensing/flexing, the legs usually go stiff, sometimes kicking, etc. When you thread a needle through the cerebellum and the area where it touches the medulla, you won't usually get a true "zero reflex" shot. You will hear snipers sometimes refer to this as "the apricot" and "the triangle"; it's not actually just the medulla, or just the cerebellum, but right where they junction. I believe it's referred to as the triangle because it is basically right at the junction area between the two condiles and the basilar (terms used in the photo, just to not make things confusing). There's a link here that might help some people picture it. http://scienceblogs.com/afarensis/20...m_how_do_we_k/

I have made some of these shots on animals before, but not usually with a .22. I think the solid (even if it is hollow point) .22 round doesn't leave much room for error, it doesn't carry much kinetic energy, and doesn't start with much; it makes it a bit more difficult to do it. On my dog that I had to put down, I was able to do this. Usually when I make this type of shot on a coyote or deer, the head is a complete "mess", for lack of a better word. The hydrostatic shock on an expanding bullet that is large (150-180 grains) and moving 3,000 fps is devastating. Usually there are large pieces of skull missing and you can't even identify many individual parts of the brain. In my experience those are the shots that take out enough of the apricot to assure of a "zero reflex" kill. I have photos that I thought you might have seen in chat of these types of shots, I can PM them to you if you like and it might help.

[ironcowboy]

My uncle lives and hunts down in WV, and all through the deer season he has problems with wild dogs (he know all his neighbors they are none of their dogs) Whole packs chase and kill deer, cats are not a much of a problem down there (i think because all the wild dogs get them) but he shoots many dogs. That said he has pet dogs, and likes dogs, but their is a big difference between a known pet, and something which is basically no different then a wolf or coyote.

[XD40coyote]

Tomcat, that is very interesting. So I guess as long as some thin bit of the spinal cord is still connected to some part of the primitive brain, a nerve signal is passed causing the twithcing and jumping around I see in raccoons. I use a solid .22 long btw, HP's caused bigger exit holes ( I seem to always get exit holes) so I quit using them. I was told to try .22 shorts, but I used those cb longs that are probably about the same unpowerful round, and was putting 2-3 into a raccoon's head instead of one, to do the job.
Now I wonder why the foxes I have shot in the head did not do any of that crazy motion like raccoons do. Maybe some very slight twitching, but what I have seen is a fox just drop like a rock and alot of blood coming out of its head. I did not notice any movement, so if it was there it must have been miniscule to where I didn't notice it. The raccoons will really move around, from 20 seconds to a full minute. The jerking is a strong jerking sometimes too, as I will try to release the paw from the trap and have to hold the raccoon with 1 hand to try and control the jerking so a claw doesn't scratch me and whatnot.

[Tomcat088]

Yes that has been my experience, even if there is even smaller pieces of spinal cord intact, signals can travel down it and you will see twitching, jerking, etc. If it is completely severed, in mammals (not all animals) that I know of, there won't be twitching jerking, etc. I would probably attribute the raccoon jerking vs foxes not jerking as much to a few things. 1. I'm sure they probably have different sizes of brain stems, and I would imagine that it would be a bit more difficult to seer the brain stem of the raccoon. We don't have very many foxes in my area, so I haven't compared their anatomy closely, but I would imagine that a full grown raccoon would have a wider brain stem, but I could be wrong (please tell me if you know the answer). I would also say part of it has to do with instincts and reflexes. When raccoons are in a fight or upset, they can really get to swinging, flailing and going nuts, I'm guessing that foxes don't quite have the same response. As I stated, I'm not around too many foxes, but I would think their instinct would be to run, or kick, and not so much fight and swing.